Agency for Change- Mike Adams, Chief Executive Officer, Purple » KidGlov

Announcer:

Welcome to Agency for Change, a podcast from KidGlov that brings you the stories of changemakers who are actively working to improve our communities. In every episode, we’ll meet with people who are making a lasting impact in the places we call home.

Kelley Peterson:

Hello everyone, this is Kelley Peterson, Vice President and Nonprofit Creative Director of KidGlov. Welcome to another episode of the Agency for Change podcast. This is a first for our podcast. Today, we are going international and welcoming Mike Adams, Chief Executive of Purple, and the organizer of Purple Tuesday, all the way from Essex, England. Mike, how are you today?

Mike Adams:

I’m good, Kelly. Really good to be with you. It’s four o’clock in the afternoon as I talk to you, it’s already been a busy day, but I cannot tell you how delighted I am to be joining you.

Kelley Peterson:

Well, same here. I’m excited about to talk with you today. Mike let’s get started by having you tell us about the work of Purple.

Mike Adams:

Yes, so Purple is about changing the disability conversation, and as a disabled person myself, I want to be viewed as someone who can contribute, give value, be a part of society, be a part of work, be a part of the community in which I live and not be labeled as someone who is disabled and really take away from the traditional views of disability is about being vulnerable people, about welfare, about being the responsibility of government. And so Purple is an organization that’s going to shift that dial and for organizations and for businesses and to disabled people be one of value and opportunity.

Kelley Peterson:

That is just wonderful. As a marketer, I do have to ask though, why Purple?

Mike Adams:

Well, you see I don’t even know. For some reason, purple is known globally as the color of disability, and I don’t know why. It’s great for me because one, I love the color purple, two, it makes my working clothes really easy because I can dress and have a purple tint every day and that’s just fashion, and three actually we’re known full name is Purple Zest. And we like the zest there as well because that’s kind of breathing life excitement, edginess in as well. So we get the best of the kind of purple and zest.

Kelley Peterson:

Yeah, such a great action word that’s not used very often and that zest does give it an energy. That’s great. And the color purple I have to agree, stands out. I might have to change my wardrobe. I’m inspired now. I noticed a section of your website that states, “For too long, conversations about disabled people have been hamstrung by fear. Fear of causing offense, of being politically incorrect or being misunderstood.” Why is this an important conversation for all of us, Mike?

Mike Adams:

You know what? Let me give you an example of where that came from. And we’re going to talk about Purple Tuesday in a few minutes, I think, but I, as a kind of non-scientific exercise about four years ago, my partner and I, we went shopping in a shopping center in the run-up to Christmas and I have to admit to your listeners, I really don’t like shopping and I really don’t like everything in the run-up to Christmas. But you have to do what you have to do, particularly when you’ve got children. And on that day we visited, we went into 28 shops and in 23 of those 28 shops, the frontline staff either totally ignored us or only spoke to my partner who is not disabled. And what we worked out is that it wasn’t absolute prejudice against disabled people, it was this fear of doing something or saying something wrong that would unintentionally offend me. And so the default position was to swerve the conversation altogether.

Mike Adams:

Now for those businesses, and any customer will know that if you go somewhere and you don’t feel wanted, then you’re not going to spend your money. And those 23 businesses didn’t get as much money or any money out of me as they possibly could. And if you’re a hiring manager, you’re not going to even interview or point to a disabled person if that is your default position. So what we’re kind of saying is if you don’t have the competence to have the starting conversation then you’re not going to have a conversation and nothing is ever going to change. And so what we want to do is change the conversation, but supports everyone to have the confidence to even start the conversation because most people will know once you get going you’re fine, it’s that fear of getting going and that applies to how people relate to disabled people as well. And just one thing to say that was in 2017, 2018.

Mike Adams:

We went back about four or five weeks ago shopping, not Christmas shopping, but summer shopping. And we went into about 18 shops and in 16 of those shops the frontline staff came over and said, “Hello, can I help you?” So really excitingly, we can see a change. We can see a societal change and what happens is we then started a conversation, and I suspect those frontline staff went home that night and their subconscious feelings and thoughts about disability changed.

Kelley Peterson:

So I’m with you about the… I don’t like shopping either. And so of those 23 out of 28 that just makes your shopping experience obviously, and these experience and emotional experience that much harder to get through. Can you tell me about, you mentioned that first it was 23 out of 28, tell me about the five. How did those make you feel?

Mike Adams:

I tell you that what I was going to spend in those five, I spent more than I thought I was going to spend in that shop. And here in the UK, there are 14 million disabled people. So if you multiply that by what I spent, there’s a huge commercial opportunity. And across the globe, there are one billion disabled people with a combined spending power. So your disposable income that equates to $8 trillion, that is a huge number. And when you think that only 10% of businesses globally have any strategies to access this disability market, you only need to think about your frontline staff saying, “Hello, can I help you?” could automatically give you access to this $8 trillion market. And I defy any board, any organization to go, “Well, on that basis, actually we don’t want to do that.” The answer is yes, they are customers. They are our customers, or we want to make them our customers. And that really is the premise of Purple Tuesday and the relationship between a business, an organization and their disabled customers.

Kelley Peterson:

The next question, Mike, is one of your initiatives is Purple Tuesday and I see that it’s coming up on November 2nd this year. Can you tell us more about that day?

Mike Adams:

Yeah. So out of that experience of the shopping centers, I then was in a meeting the following week, very coincidental with the retail sector and government here in the UK. And they were looking for initiatives and I kind of said, “Well, look, you know, in terms of disability you’ve got Black Friday, you’ve got Cyber Monday. Why don’t we do something around disability? Why don’t we do it on a Tuesday? You know, Friday’s taken, Monday’s taken, why don’t we do it on a Tuesday? And the international disability color is purple so we’ll call it Purple Tuesday.” And that’s how it was born. And in many ways, the beneficiaries of Purple Tuesday are disabled people and their families, because what it aims to do is drive a better quality experience. But actually, Purple Tuesday is about supporting businesses to make those improvements in their businesses that will enable and want disabled people to go spend in their shops.

Mike Adams:

So the benefit is for businesses to open up their markets to disabled people, but disabled people will be the beneficiaries because they’ll have that quality experience. And when we are talking about improvements and access, you know, in 2021 a lot of the improvements that are being made are digital accessibility, online ones, making sure that your website is accessible to disabled people. And we know that during lockdown and COVID pandemics that it was one of the biggest restrictions for disabled people in accessing basic information and buying of products and services. They just couldn’t navigate a website because the website wasn’t accessible, but it’s also stuff like better signage that just makes improvements.

Mike Adams:

Making sure that your accessible toilet facilities are one, unlocked and two, not… A young disabled person said to me the other day, when we were talking about what they want as a disabled consumer, they said, “One day, Mike, we young people will be running this town and I don’t want to compete against the mop.” And I’m what they meant was they’re supposed to be the next generation, but they go out and they need the toilet and they get into the accessible facilities and they can’t get in because it’s become a store cupboard with mops and buckets. And there’s an irony about that.

Mike Adams:

So it’s all the things that we’re talking about really low cost, no cost right now. And there will always be, you know, we need ramps and we’ll need lifts and stuff but that’s one end of the spectrum. Most of the changes that we are talking about and that are relevant to organizations and businesses are really small mindset ones. It’s about working out that these individuals are first and foremost, your customers or potential customers. And secondly, they may have a disability that may need some reasonable adjustments that are easy to do. And if you make those adjustments, they are going to be what we know is disabled people once they attach themselves to a brand are the most loyal group of individuals to that brand. So it just makes commercial sense and increasingly now post-COVID, it makes social impact sense as well.

Kelley Peterson:

So much so. I like what you said about beneficiaries, but both sides of that coin are going to benefit greatly. I also like what you talked about it being low cost. And would you say one of the biggest barriers is just awareness? They don’t know if they made these changes that it would open up opportunities to benefit both of those.

Mike Adams:

Well, let me give you an absolute example. So globally, the international sign for disability that has done so much to promote disabled people is the wheelchair. And whether you’re in America or whether you’re in the far East or the UK, you will know instantly that sign. But globally, only 8% of disabled people are wheelchair users. So it creates a misnomer in terms of who this group of people are. And 80% of disabled people have hidden invisible disabilities. So the assumptions that people intuitively make don’t work, because if someone’s got a hidden disability you won’t necessarily know. And one of the things that we’ve absolutely found is that frontline staff changing their introduction conversation to “hello, can I help you?” Is one: neutral, is two: really supportive in a customer service way, but three: it gives that individual the opportunity to say, “No, absolutely I’m fine. Thank you very much.” Or, “Well, actually I have an anxiety issue, a mental health issue. It’s really noisy environment here, but I need to speak to you. Do you mind if we just take five steps to the left where is somewhere that quieter because I need to ask you a question?”

Mike Adams:

And that could be the difference between that individual staying, having their question answered and then buying in that place and probably forever and ever more or turning around and leaving. And what we know is with Purple Tuesday organizations where they got their staff to learn “hello” and “goodbye” in sign language. And the difference that made to the deaf community in feeling welcome was absolutely huge. And that took staff 10 minutes using the internet to learn those two signs, and I can tell you absolutely, they learned more than “hello” and “goodbye,” because it was just so easy and it makes such a difference. And there’s so many things, even digital changes that web developers and us can make overnight in 10 minutes that will make a huge difference to the navigation of websites.

Kelley Peterson:

Yes, Mike, I just want to shout all of this from the rooftops because it’s so unknown and that you could make simple, low-cost changes and in fact, change the world because of it. Your comment about invisible disabilities… I’m going to give just a short story about that because I think that we can connect with kids and just people of all ages. And this isn’t necessarily a disability story, but if people can realize things within their own lives that could have happened and have experienced just a piece of this, I think it’s remarkable. So my son in high school was a football player, had concussion. And the hardest thing about having that concussion to him was the difference between somebody fracturing a limb or something where everyone could see that that player could no longer play football. But that you felt like no one could see that he had a concussion and was going into class.

Kelley Peterson:

And so everyone around him just like the storekeepers that you were mentioning in the businesses, his whole environment switched. And no one knew that he couldn’t do what was used to be able to do, whether that be forever or for a short period of time. And so I think if people can think about examples in their own lives, when they have that feeling, they can easily turn that in and make those changes that you’re talking about to make it more accessible for everyone.

Mike Adams:

Absolutely. And the one thing we do know with, if there is ever a positive legacy from COVID-19, it will be the fact that it has brought mental health and mental health issues to the absolute fore. And I’m absolutely convinced that mental health taboo that existed in all parts of society will be absolutely obliterated because people who never had the two thought that they would be affected by mental health, they have been, their families have been, and it now has resonance. And that is a hidden invisible disability that was kept in the shadows, was taboo that suddenly people are going to go, “Well, actually I know someone. I’ve been there myself however, temporarily it might be. And actually this is not acceptable.”

Mike Adams:

And I think I spend 80% of my time at the moment talking about two things, which is one, online accessibility because we as a society, we as a world are changing our habits and online is becoming part of the norm. And two, it’s mental health and wellbeing because people are being touched who have never been touched before. And we are talking 22% of the global population have rights under disability in some way, you know, and I was talking to someone the other day who had cancer, was recovering from cancer. And I said, “You do know you have rights under disability legislation here in the UK?” And she went, “No, I’d never realized.”

Mike Adams:

So we are talking about a huge number of people. The world’s largest minority group is disabled people and businesses and organizations cannot afford to ignore 22% of the population economically, commercially, socially it doesn’t work. So whether you want to do it, or whether you’re going to come kicking and screaming to get involved, I don’t care but you’re going to have to, and it will work for disabled people and it will work for businesses and therefore it will work for the wider community in which we all live.

Kelley Peterson:

Yes. Mike, I know that Purple Tuesday is really gaining momentum in England. Have you ever considered expanding the effort to the United States?

Mike Adams:

Well, I’ll let you and your listeners into a secret. So we have been operating Purple Tuesday in the UK for four years and it’s getting bigger and bigger. So last year our reach was 11.3 million people. And in the center of London, Piccadilly Circus, Piccadilly Lights we have half an hour at eight o’clock in the morning UK time where Purple Tuesday is the absolute central thing. Not to make any political statements, but last year Purple Tuesday was on the day of the American elections. But eight o’clock in the morning here well, you were all sleeping and we had a huge, huge response. And a huge response globally for people saying, “Well, look, we are here. We have disabled customers. The principles are exactly the same. We would like Purple Tuesday to operate where we are.”

Mike Adams:

And so this year on International Day for People with Disabilities, the UN day it is going to be World Expo which is taking place in Dubai in the Middle East. And I will be in Dubai on the 3rd of December in the British Pavilion, and we’ll live stream a session which I hope I can give you the details near the time. And I hope your listeners will watch where we will announce that in 2022 Purple Tuesday is going global. And so I am actively and want to work with people in America to make sure that Purple Tuesday has resonance, significance and works for the United States.

Mike Adams:

So we’re coming after you. We want to be a part of you. We want your disabled customers to have better improved customer experience because that is part of the bounce back from COVID 19. And it will work for your businesses in America, as well as disabled of people. So absolutely we do, but it will need to work in a way that works for you and as long as it’s in purple, which you love anyway, we will be absolutely fine and we will make it work with you and we are looking forward to it.

Kelley Peterson:

I’m looking forward to it too. How absolutely exciting. So for those companies out there, what advice do you have for them to improve the disabled customer experience?

Mike Adams:

A few things I would say is one, and if they’ve been listening to this, they will understand that disabled people are a huge group. Once you understand who you are talking about, it’s much easier then to do something. And I think this is fear of, “oh it’s going to be too costly, is too much to do when you know, we really we’ve got other priorities.” And I would say, start by making some commitments that can be delivered. And if you are a business that uses the websites and online services, you can make accessibility changes overnight that will increase the traffic of disabled people. Start using imagery of disability and disabled people because it will attract disabled people.

Mike Adams:

So I think one: do something. Two: absolute understand the commercials in engaging with disabled customers. And I talk about the 8 trillion worldwide purple dollar. I talk about the fact that only 10% of businesses have a strategy. So there is a huge opportunity to differentiate yourself and provide a service to a market who is absolutely underserved and is waiting for you to show an interest in them and provide a service and think about social impact and think about you as a brand. And the fact that whether it’s your staff or whether it’s your customers, or whether it’s your investors, they will expect you as a brand to show social impact. And disability can be a quick, easy, effective way in which to demonstrate that.

Mike Adams:

So I think at one level, it’s non-negotiable. Two: it’s easy to access. You could make a start, and three: if I was to give a piece of advice in terms of who I would target in your organization, one, you need to make the social and economic arguments to your board, your senior management team, because they need to drive this. Two, to talk about disabled customers you need your frontline staff to be trained to have the confidence to be able to say “hello, can I help you?” And then in terms of your employment, because good organizations will want to reflect in their workforce, their customer base. So if you’re starting to drive more disabled customers, then intuitively you’ll want to reflect that in your workforce.

Mike Adams:

And with 80% of disabled people having invisible disabilities, I can absolutely tell everyone that you will have more disabled people in your workforce than you think you already do because they won’t, or they feel they won’t need to disclose. And if you can encourage an environment of disclosure, suddenly overnight you will have people in your organization who will go. “Do you know what? I feel able to disclose the fact that I’ve got a hidden disability, because this is the way my organization is going.” And they will be your biggest marketers for recruitment of talent as well. So you need to equip your line managers to be confident in supporting disabled staff.

Mike Adams:

And just the one quick story, I worked with the big corporates, and we’ve been working with them for eight months and their chief executive virtually did “Thank God It’s Friday” session and he did it on disability and he said all the things that they’d done and they were going to do. And did anyone have any comments? Interestingly asking those questions virtually everyone normally stays on mute or only uses the chat box function and he waited. And after about 10 seconds, someone came off mute and said, “I never thought I would ever see the day, but I am going to tell everyone that I’ve got a mental health condition. I had a mental health condition for the last 15 years that I’ve kept secret. But today is the day I’m going to tell everyone because I think my organization is ready to support me.” And the chief executive went, “Wow.” And then about three seconds later, someone said, “Well on that basis, I also feel I’ve had dyslexia and I go home every night and work two extra hours in order because that’s my coping strategy to hide my dyslexia. But today is the day I think I’m telling everyone I’m dyslexic. I’m proud and can contribute to the organization.”

Mike Adams:

10 minutes later, three others have done exactly the same with different disabilities. And within 20 minutes he had five extra disabled people that I absolutely know had a ripple effect and is changing the culture and more and more people are disclosing. And now that their name is getting out and they’re attracting disabled talent because of the culture of that organization. And that started from what can we do? The chief executive’s going to be committed we’re going to start having conversations about mental health and wellbeing and it’s snowballed. And so it can be done.

Mike Adams:

So wherever an organization is on their disability inclusion journey, actually you can make progress and quick progress. Your staff will expect it, your customers will expect it, and your investors will increasingly want to see it. So I think it’s a no brainer. I think don’t try to overachieve just do things that you can deliver and you will suddenly get traction and you’ll suddenly find there’s a level of momentum and you’ll look back and go. “My goodness, we’ve achieved a lot in the last year. Actually we can achieve more.” And the organizations that have joined us on Purple Tuesday we’ve always said just make one commitment to do something that you haven’t done before. And now they’re making five, six, seven commitments and they’re going, “Well, we can do that. We can do that within six months. We don’t have to wait a year.” And they’re seeing the benefits from their staff and disabled people who want to go and shop with them, who want to kind of engage with them, who want to be their customers, who want to have them as their brand and it’s brilliant.

Kelley Peterson:

It is brilliant. Thank you so much for sharing those stories that you could just feel and see happening. And that ripple effect that you described is really something and just that great advice of making one commitment and you’ve seen it time and time again turn into more and you can grow that way, baby steps.

Mike Adams:

Yeah.

Kelley Peterson:

So I’m really curious how did you get involved with this type of work?

Mike Adams:

Well, and that’s a story in itself really, because I as I was growing up wanted to be a business leader and I really didn’t want to be defined as a disabled person doing disability. So I kind of raged against the machine and was absolutely determined not to do anything to do with disability. And I’d just graduated, I got a interview with a well-known large kind of organization in retail as part of their business graduate scheme. And I’d never been so prepared in my life for an interview is what I really wanted to do. And I went there and there was a panel of eight people and the chair started the interview and asked me my name and why I was there. And after about a minute and a half, she just stopped me and she said, “Mike, I’m really sorry, but you know, and I know that you are not going to get appointed on this graduate scheme. So it’s better we stop the interview now and you must be used to disappointments.”

Mike Adams:

And that was in the very, very, very early 1990s, which gives my kind of age away a little bit. And in fact that I can tell that story and it’s still so raw. I never want a disabled person to go through that experience again and be defined by their disability. And it kind of gave me the passion to kind of go, “Well, actually, if that’s where we are then I do want to work in disability because I want the next generation and the next generation not to go through what I’ve gone through.” And that’s where it came from and I’ve ended up kind of Chief Executive of Purple in an organization that is going to be part of absolutely changing the world. And we’ve got plenty of allies and plenty in the United States as well and together we are absolutely going to change the world so the next generation and the next generation never have to go through that kind of experience and disability becomes normal.

Kelley Peterson:

You don’t need my belief, but I’m going to give it to you. And I think you’re going to do just that. I think you already have. So at KidGlov we’re inspired by motivational quotes. Could you give us a few of your own words of wisdom for our listeners?

Mike Adams:

Yeah. I could do one quote that I use a lot to businesses is “make disability your business” which works at many different levels. You can’t opt out, you shouldn’t opt out, you need to make disability your business. Did you know that 50% of people will either have a disabled relative or someone in their close network who has rights under disability? And on that basis, that’s one in two. Disability is all our business. So make sure you make it your business. I’ve used it a number of times, it’s our strap line, changing the disability conversation. I think it’s really important that we’re on the front foot and we’re saying exactly what it is. And my disability was also inspired by the way, from Berkeley in the United States where the user-led movement started, it originated and it originated from Vietnam vets coming back to America and going, “We’re not prepared to be locked away. We’re not prepared to be shut away. We’re not prepared for our life to be determined by others”. And they set up the user movement which inspired here in the UK and has been an inspiration to me ever since.

Mike Adams:

And it’s interesting that three years ago, I had two children. I’ve subsequently had twins, so our family has expanded, but we went on a holiday of a lifetime through Vietnam. And we ended up in Ho Chi Minh City, what was Saigon at the War Museum. And if you’ve never been it’s one place that you should go and it was so moving to see the carnage caused. And I spoke to my two kids and said, “This is why I do what I do. And this is where the inspiration comes from.” And we came out and we met people selling stuff on stools that were third generation of the carnage of Vietnam and were disabled. And both my kids bought a gift from that store, which is their most prized possession ever. And they both realize when I’m not around and when I do long hours, why I do it. And I think it’s incredibly important.

Mike Adams:

And there’s a saying “Nothing about us without us,” that originated from that user-led movement. And it’s kind of my kind of guiding principle which is really important. I also use “not disabled yet” because people think disability is binary, but 83% of disabled people acquire their disability throughout their lifetime. So you may not be disabled yet, but there’s a good chance before your life ends that you are. So I think that’s an important reminder and disability is both visible and hidden. And it’s really important that we remember that there’s such a broad, diverse group of disabled people within the disability community. And as I said it’s not just wheelchair users, they comprise 8%. So it’s really important to remember who we are talking about when we talk about disabled people.

Kelley Peterson:

Wow. So much incredible information and just to open our minds to think about. And the quote that you used make disability your business, of course, as a marketer and a brander, I love that play on words and it just really connects with people. And I bet that’s why that works so well. I too have been drawn to the statement, “nothing about us without us.” And, in my history, I’ve worked with a lot of foster youth and they embodied that statement as well, just because it feels oftentimes that things are being done for them, that they didn’t have a voice it and that statement speaks really strong obviously for people with disabilities that you can see or that you can’t see. So Mike, for our listeners who would like to learn more about your work and how to support you, how can they find out more about your organization and initiatives?

Mike Adams:

Well, at one level I have embraced social media. So I have a LinkedIn account. I think look up Mike Adams Purple, hopefully you’ll find me. I’ve got a growing audience from America and because of COVID-19 we had staycations this year and what our family… What we do as a family is we pick a country and then the whole night is around that theme and in tribute to the growing work we do with colleagues in America, including you, by the way, your organization. We did a tribute to America over the summer and that’s one of my recent posts so look that up. And I do a post twice a week on issues that resonate around disability. And in some ways, it was interesting that I saw a marketing report about the Olympics and the viewing figures on NBC or the broadcaster was down. Their analysis was that now people follow individuals on Instagram or LinkedIn, because that’s the story they want.

Mike Adams:

And so, you know, I can give you my website, which is wearepurple.org.uk, which has all the information, but increasingly people are consuming information about Purple and what we do through LinkedIn, through Instagram, through Facebook. So you can find us there. And as I said to you earlier we’re coming to America, we’re coming to the States. Purple Tuesday is going to be global. And so it might not be about you just finding me, but I’m going to come and find you as well because in every part of America and every part of the world we want people to understand that first and foremost, disabled people are consumers, they’re potential employees, they’re contributors to the community in which they live, whether that’s in a voluntary capacity or a paid capacity and they’re part of the fabric of what makes a society really strong and really great.

Mike Adams:

And I am absolutely delighted to be able to talk to you about the passion and about why disability is so important or should be so important to everyone in the United States and everyone in the world. And I think coming together we can connect now in a way in which even five years ago we could never have connected. And the issues that affect me and impact me on a day-to-day basis are pretty much the same as the issues that will impact disabled people and their families in the United States and elsewhere in the world. So we are all connected and there is resonance and that’s why it’s become so powerful so quickly because the issues that you face are the ones that I absolutely understand and can tell a story about and just listening to us both today, it resonates, which is so important. And if you’ve got that and you’ve got passion and you’ve got people who want to do something about it, then you absolutely can. And that’s why I talk about make disability your business and make it a priority. Do something about it.

Kelley Peterson:

As we wrap up our time together today, what is the most important thing you would like our listeners to remember about the work you’re doing?

Mike Adams:

I think the fact that when we talk disability now just understand the group of people we are actually talking about and it is vast, that visible and that hidden. And the fact that disability is a global issue and we are part and parcel of a smaller and smaller village where we have the same connection. So it doesn’t matter whether I’m in the UK or whether I’m in Nebraska or quite frankly, whether I’m in the far East, we are absolutely united by the same issues. And wherever you come on the issue, whether you’re disabled yourself, whether you’ve got lived experience of disability, or whether you run a business that has had no previous connection with disability, disability is the biggest growing minority group in the world. And if you get it right, there are huge commercial, economic, and social benefits.

Mike Adams:

So it’s not a nice thing to do now. It’s a thing that has to be done. And people like me and others are giving you free advice and guidance on how you can grow your business and grow your market for the benefit of everyone. And I hope that people will take away that doing nothing is no longer an option. So just do something and you will find getting traction really quickly, getting momentum really quickly, and it’ll work for you as well as disabled people.

Kelley Peterson:

Mike, I, so thank you for that great advice that you’ve shared with me personally and all of the listeners. I fully believe that the world needs more people like you. Thank you for taking the time to share with us today.

Mike Adams:

Thank you.

Announcer:

We hope you enjoyed today’s Agency for Change podcast. To hear all our interviews with those who are making a positive change in our communities, or to nominate a change-maker you’d love to hear from visit kidglov.com, at kidglov.com to get in touch. As always, if you like what you’ve heard today, be sure to rate, review, subscribe, and share. Thanks for listening and we’ll see you next time.

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